Got Rank?

[Data 2]

Hello lotus peeps,

Question - How does the now functioning rank system work?? It seems very difficult to move up in rank. I don't get to play every day so I often slip down a bit after being away for a few days. However, once I am able to play for a while, it takes a long time to move up.

Are the rankings based on play time? Overall score? Number of kills? Kill/death ratio?

Any thoughts??

[Spartan_0214 18]

Key Point: I don't get to play every day

Mostly based on time played. Other than that, k/d, I think.

[Moby 24]

http://stats.lotusclan.com/X/hlstats.php?mode=help

[Data 2]

Oh sweet, very helpful Moby. Thanks!

[Melissia 7]

He's not joking. Most of what matters appears to be time played. I moved up two thousand ranks just by playing for two days, and if I stop playing for a week, I'll drop back down. I could probably get up to the fourties easily if I wanted to play all day every day for a while.

[phantom 29]

time played doesnt have much to do with it, however with higher time played youre more likely do have done things that will give you points

[Moby 24]

Increased time played can also backfire on you. (If you're having a bad day, if the team you're on is so terrible that you have no control over the map, etc.) But generally, yes, playing more helps. If you looks at the formula in the link I posted, the goal is to kill higher ranked players, and not be killed by lower ranked players. Besides that, melee whenever possible (for the 2x points), and do things like blowing out teamates that are on fire.

[Melissia 7]

I dunno, I have never moved down in rank unless I just didn't play.

[Bombz 31]

The reason WHY time is a factor in TF2 and FPS games in general is because it HAS to be a factor.

The only other meaningful statistics which show skill are kills per minute and kills per death. BOTH of which change drastically on which class you play. For example, naturally as a medic or engineer you're not going to kill as much as say a Demoman/Soldier/Heavy on the front lines. Consequently you won't make as many kills per minute. Likewise for Kills per death you're going to get considerably more kills on average per death using a Sniper as you would a Spy. Since the Spy class revolves around getting in close and there is much higher risk.

That is why you cannot use those two measurements alone as a determination. So what options are there then, left to rank players? The answer is a points system and it's what Psychostats/HLStatsx use.

If you're a relatively decent player your first week or two of playing is going to net you some serious points, why? Because you didn't have many points and you're earning a bunch of points by killing those that have a much higher point accumulation than you do. Let's suppose that you kill Fred who has 16,000 points, but you only had 2,000. You're going to earn some serious points from that even if you may be better than Fred, the points system doesn't know that you're better until you have the amount of points he does.

The idea is that good players getting killed by bad players (Or those with not many points) lose lots of points and bad players getting killed by good players don't lose as many. And then there is a happy medium when a good player kills another good player.

The only reason TIME matters is because it requires time to accumulate the points to be up there. But once you go past the top 10 playing often won't really help you much. I've had 4 hour sessions where I only earned 100 points. Because as you get higher in rank you lose tons of points when someone out of say the top 100 kills you and very few for the other kills you get. Of course this is open to exploitation and the ranking system doesn't factor in strength of teams in any of its calculations but it is the way it works.

As everything else in life, you're not going to be really good at something unless a lot of time is involved.

[phantom 29]

the main problem is this

Team Fortress 2 Yes No No No Critical Kill -1

being a pure skill based system, a critical kill should net you +20 points

[Melissia 7]

As everything else in life, you're not going to be really good at something unless a lot of time is involved.

Not true

Killerkeg doesn't play as often as Phantom does, but Killerkeg is worlds better than Phantom.

Aside from that jest, however, some people learn the game faster than others, some people have natural skill, some people do both. Some people are quite damned good at the game but just don't have time to play that often-- but when they do they make a huge impact.

[Bombz 31]

Not true

Killerkeg doesn't play as often as Phantom does, but Killerkeg is worlds better than Phantom.

Aside from that jest, however, some people learn the game faster than others, some people have natural skill, some people do both. Some people are quite damned good at the game but just don't have time to play that often-- but when they do they make a huge impact.

That is somewhat true. At the risk of being called out for not having stats to prove it I will say that most people in life have to actually practice what they do (assuming for example, it's a recreational activity) to be good at it.

There are some natural talents that don't have to really practice much, or at all, but those people are the small minority.

Jordan got good by practicing and playing, as do many other greats in sports. That goes for most things. Though you are right, some people acquire a skill faster than others but that never means their skill ceiling is higher, however. Sometimes the hardest workers who end up being the slowest learners turn out to be the best through dedication.

This is going to sound kind of lame and cheesy, but I used to work at a Pizza restaurant. It took me forever to learn to do sheet outs (Which is flattening the dough properly to create a crust) run it through the sheeter and fit it to the pan properly. However, after practicing it tons I became so quick at it that I could press sheet outs with one hand while running pressed dough balls through the sheeter machine.

[Zephyr 14]

Critical kills are worth -1 point? Why?

That means means if a high ranked player kills a low rank player with a crit, they actually LOSE points. That's ridiculous. The crit penalty should be removed because the Victim Points / Killer Points * 5 ratio can result in much less than a full point for high ranked players.

Also, its strange that a headshot gets more points than an ubercharge considering the relative time and difficulty of the actions.

[Graedus 9]

95% of Phantom's kills are either headshots or krit stickies. He should be ranked lower than his beard (Currently ranked 282).

[Zephyr 14]

There's a big difference between a headshot and a crit sticky kill. If a high ranking player kills a new player, the headshot is woth 2 to 3 points (3 points if rounding up rather than rounding to the nearest), and a crit sticky kill is worth -1 to 0 points (0 points if rounding up rather than rounding to the nearest). Also, Snipers can't get crits with their primary weapon, so they never have the -1 penalty.

I think the point system needs to be rebalanced a little.

[phantom 29]

Critical kills are worth -1 point? Why?

cause crits are pure skill based

95% of Phantom's kills are either bodyshots or random pipe spam. He should be ranked higher than his beard (Currently ranked #1 in my heart).

fix'd/who the fuck is Phantom?

Also, Snipers can't get crits with their primary weapon, so they never have the -1 penalty.

kritz, also headshots are crits.

[Spartan_0214 18]

I lol'd. And, phantom, you're forgetting the pro Jarate-enhanced bodyshots.

[Zephyr 14]

kritz, also headshots are crits.

Well, ubered Snipers are pretty rare. But you may be right about headshots being crits. I know it makes the crit sound, but it doesn't show up as a crit in the upper right as you make the kill. I assumed it wasn't considered a crit because it didn't show up in the even log as a crit, but apparently neither to sticky crits.

One way or another, a headshot nets at least two more points than a crit sticky.

[phantom 29]

I lol'd. And, phantom, you're forgetting the pro Jarate-enhanced bodyshots.

im completely against juicing

Well, ubered Snipers are pretty rare. But you may be right about headshots being crits. I know it makes the crit sound, but it doesn't show up as a crit in the upper right as you make the kill. I assumed it wasn't considered a crit because it didn't show up in the even log as a crit, but apparently neither to sticky crits.

One way or another, a headshot nets at least two more points than a crit sticky.

ubered/kritz'd snipers are anything but rare, you are playing on the wrong servers. headshots are crits(150x3 full charge). so are backstabs, but they dont need to be cause they actually flat out kill your target

[Zephyr 14]

ubered/kritz'd snipers are anything but rare, you are playing on the wrong servers.

They should be rare. There are at least three classes that are able to consistently use krit ubers better than snipers.

[Spartan_0214 18]

But in a pinch sniper works just fine.

[Miyari 33]

They should be rare. There are at least three classes that are able to consistently use krit ubers better than snipers.

Classes, maybe, but players? Probably not. Nearly every class can perform the exact same job while ubered but it all depends on the player's skill and ability.

Also, ubering snipers is Gabe's will be done.

[Spartan_0214 18]

Classes, maybe, but players? Probably not. Nearly every class can perform the exact same job while ubered but it all depends on the player's skill and ability.

Specialization is the key to every class in Team Fortress 2. While each can perform the same job, it is generally unwise for one class to perform the actions of another. Sure, a heavy can take out a sentry with an uber, but even a poor demoman can take down a sentry gun easier than a Heavy. As a medic, choose the class you uber wisely. If there are a lot of sentry guns, do not uber a heavy as he will go flying across the map, even if he's ubered. I would rather uber a far less competent demoman in that circumstance. You can uber just about anything and make headway, but if you choose your classes wisely, even if the person you're ubering doesn't play that class well, you will make far greater headway than if you just randomly dropped an uber on, say, a sniper. If you need to deploy the uber right away, then, yes, by all means uber a sniper, but a good medic always knows where the team is and will uber the proper class.

Edited December 5, 2009 by Spartan_0214

[Paul Bunyan 13]

I uber spycrabs.

[Rigormortis 15]

I uber spycrabs.

Possibly the most potential fun to be had in the game.

It makes Miyari rage. <3