To All The Traders Out There.

[Wrecking Balls 2,507]

http://forums.steamrep.com/threads/76561197986567122-smokedgouda001-and-76561198037908684-stf2-updated.9825/

You should all read this.

[+Skaila 5,462]

I always used that spreadsheet as a reference to sell items. Well dayum

[Hawkear 97]

Trust me this only affects the real high end traders, and even then it's not that big of a hit. It's more just about the principle of the matter, what an ass to scam people as such a high authority member, that is just sad, but valve should ban him for this, I mean it is pretty bad what he is doing now. But is it against their rules, that is what i want to know?

[Se7en 10,762]

lol, traders

[- Mike - 2,728]

I figured something was up, I guess I was making the same trades of buds and keys that he was because I made some decent loot the a while back for a couple months.

[JoinedSenses 559]

Just like the american stock market...

[Chez-Box 3,240]

this is a pretty big deal, keep in mind that the TF2 item economy is worth ~ 25 million dollars, there are some people out there who really did get screwed

[Se7en 10,762]

this is a pretty big deal, keep in mind that the TF2 item economy is worth ~ 25 million dollars, there are some people out there who really did get screwed

TF2: Serious business. Yes, sir.

[Banshee 236]

......:'(

I was already confused about prices for things!

[DutchKev 425]

prime example, B.M.O.C was worth 8 keys when i bought mine, - within a week it had rose to 20 keys?!

how does such an inflation even happen in less than 7 days? demand for the bmoc isnt that high surely?

[darkness-07 115]

well this is what i have been waiting for: I TOLD YOU SO. people are always saying "spreadsheets say this" "spreadsheets say that" and I said it is run by a unidentified person and it changes quite frequently. dont trust it. i called it spreadshit multiple times xD

good of you to point out balls, i often refer to spreadsheets for a general price, but the best way to get a price check is search what people are buying it for (searching on tf2op for example), then searching for what people are selling for, and that gives you a range. obviously some people lowball and others highball so it is not always correct, but doing your own research is better than trusting a site like this

[Chez-Box 3,240]

can't go wrong with trading for what you WANT, instead of what something is supposedly worth... if someone has an item i want, and i have an item that they want, lets make a deal, do i care if the supposed value of my item is 1 reclaimed more than the item i want? no, i just want my guys to look awesome

[Marcel the Shell 403]

As someone who has done ALOT of trading (probably should have been working on my play instead of my loadout), this has been common knowledge amongst 'sharks' for a long time. I think this is the main reason why people who invested alot of cash into TF2 like Vo0 and other 'large collectors' have recently pulled out with very large losses. Where did that money go? It went to people that inflated items that they purchased from the unboxer, created hype, and sold them for high prices. VIRTUAL ITEMS HAVE NO VALUE, this arguement can be countered by saying that people pay for them with REAL MONEY, but in REALITY THEY ARE WORTHLESS. And are only as valuable as their HYPE in the community.

Just as surprising a fact that hasn't been realized yet is that buds always sell for 18-22 $ in RU, and people sell them quickly for 30$ in NA or english speaking TF2. This has left a huge 8-12$ gap for anyone who can play in the Webmoney to Paypal market.

As a professional trader trading Crude Oil futures daily, I completely agree with Joined-Senses, manipulation is how it all works, all you need is the sheep to participate, and to never ask the question...... Why??

PS Joined Senses, its Global Manipulation not just American, EU biggest joke ever

[pockets 1,841]

VIRTUAL ITEMS HAVE NO VALUE, this arguement can be countered by saying that people pay for them with REAL MONEY, but in REALITY THEY ARE WORTHLESS. And are only as valuable as their HYPE in the community.

You could make the argument that diamonds have no value since they have no real purpose. Communities apply value to useless things all the time, but that doesn't mean they're worthless. Yes, TF2 items are virtual and cannot be physically held in your hand, but owning a copy of Adobe Photoshop CS6 Extended is worth $400 yet it's a virtual item.

So think of earbuds as virtual diamonds. Their only purpose is to look pretty in a community that values it.

[Se7en 10,762]

LOL pixels, why you so silly? :]

[Nano 7,892]

You could make the argument that diamonds have no value since they have no real purpose. Communities apply value to useless things all the time, but that doesn't mean they're worthless. Yes, TF2 items are virtual and cannot be physically held in your hand, but owning a copy of Adobe Photoshop CS6 Extended is worth $400 yet it's a virtual item.

So think of earbuds as virtual diamonds. Their only purpose is to look pretty in a community that values it.

Key word here is virtual. You can pick up a diamond, not so with (as se7en puts it) pixels.

[pockets 1,841]

I had an example for that: the $400 software that you can't touch. Is it worthless?

[No longer a Sexy King:^) 5,592]

Edit: "Piratebay adobe cs6 link here".

I deleted it just in case someone calls the police.

Edited September 10, 2012 by Sexy King

[Mars 288]

Edit: "Piratebay adobe cs6 link here".

I deleted it just in case someone calls the police.

I called the Royal Canadian Mounties. They will be riding horseback across the Atlantic to your house.

[Krash 1,040]

Wow. Fucking wow.

>.>

[CobraShikari 23]

Hold on, does this mean i've been using wrong item prices on tf2spreadsheet for my trading thread? I'm rather confused here. But in all honesty, this guy sounds like such an arse for virtual items

[- Oli - 1,121]

You could make the argument that diamonds have no value since they have no real purpose. Communities apply value to useless things all the time, but that doesn't mean they're worthless. Yes, TF2 items are virtual and cannot be physically held in your hand, but owning a copy of Adobe Photoshop CS6 Extended is worth $400 yet it's a virtual item.

So think of earbuds as virtual diamonds. Their only purpose is to look pretty in a community that values it.

http://www.thisiswhyimbroke.com/ - How dare you insult some of the most uselessly epic things i've ever seen.

I would love to wear pyjamas that look like a suit to bed and feel like a boss/moss.

Well value only applies to an item if somebody wants it. Something could be rare but useless and so people do not value it whereas if it was something people liked or wanted then it would be worth it. Think of it in terms of this: The value of an item is only as much as someone is willing to pay for it.

WARNING MASSIVE RANT ABOUT VALVE - the truth about keys, hats and all the other money-wasters they do lol.

[RANT]

As far as these virtual goods goes they are positively reinforcing people who open crates by giving them a drop from it but also only strongly positively reinforcing them by rarely giving them a really good drop. If you look at skinner (psychologist) and his experiments this is akin to the rats pushing a lever receiving food - they pushed the lever and push rates went up. However when they were rewarded with food only randomnly when they pushed the lever they pushed the lever at a ridiculously high rate. This explains the random drop as the random reward which causes people to become hooked onto opening crates so much. The psychological pulls in this game and the real strong urges to do things like open a crate for the ultra rare unusual have caused people to waste so much money thinking it's worth something.

My response to this - I got rid of my hats and now only look for the weapons and occassionally strange weapons. This is because if you have no hats to collect you cannot be persuaded by the game to try and play more/trade/buy items to get better hats and other items. This way i'm free of their psychological pulls. If people genuinely looked at it in the way you do perhaps valve wouldn't have made half as much money. At the current time I have some hats from playing MvM and over 160 weapons collected (but not done anything with) in my time of playing tf2. Perhaps when an update comes out it'll be enough for what matters or the new weapons - The things that affect your performance in game, but still are virtual goods that when tf2 dies (if it does, or a sequel is made) then they will become worthless.

Valves response to this - makes new game mode MvM where to play for goodies you have to buy tickets (which I traded for some just to play a bit) when the random reward was a gold botkiller. Got some people playing a hell of a lot and spenidng so much money on tickets.

Must admit they are really good at using psychological pulls and techniques to lure people into parting with so much money. Makes me wonder how many psychologists they hire to do this and if this manipulation ever gets to a point where it perhaps shouldn't happen any more? Well one thing is for sure, at least valve do it slyly enough and aren't blatently retarded such as the likes of infinity ward - let's make a game each year that is identical almost to it's predeccesor, charge like £40-50 for it and then release 4 new maps for another £15 a month after the game is released - people buy the game because the previous one becomes dead because of the hype for the new release. At least valve say - hey look here we have a free game, you never have to pay for anything but then you can easily get lured/tricked into parting with your money - the money that has been made from keys, tickets and other such items will have outweighed the money spent on tf2 since it became free.

Oh and then the - BUY THIS GAME TO HAVE GENUINES made so much more money for valve and the company who released the game. Now forcing some people to buy a game for like £30 and often they do it just for an item in tf2.

[/RANT]

Oh also just wondering are these crystalline (industrial) or crystallised (jewellery) diamonds?

Edited September 13, 2012 by - Oli -

[Marcel the Shell 403]

^^ Awesome!

[pockets 1,841]

I think it was pretty clear I was talking about jewelry.

Anyways, I also read that cracked article.

I never said that spending a lot of money on TF2 items was a good idea. I'm was saying that they aren't worthless. Will they be worthless in the future? Of course. 15 years ago people bought Beanie Babies for hundreds of dollars. At the time they were worth something, now they aren't. Everything is like that. Prussian Franks used to be worth whatever their currency said, but now you can't buy shit with Prussian Franks. I'm not confused about any of that.

If you want to get TF2 items without spending any money, use tf2wh.com. I've been using it since I've gotten into items and trading etc. You won't have to spend a dime.

[Se7en 10,762]

I regret nothing.