Still Don't Get It

[BOOM=DYNAMITE 2]

Team Fortress is that...

A TEAM GAME.

What I say during a game is just that... WORDS.

Being banned for WORDS, just doesn't make sense.

I play the game right, I play it well, I play it hard. Nobody can debate that. What does it matter what I say to people who are playing sniper/spy/scout on a bad team? I ask people to switch from certain classes when the team is not doing well. There is nothing wrong with that. They don't have to listen. They have every right to continue to snipe, spy, or play scout. I have the right to bitch about it.

I have never had problems with good players, or good games. I don't have a problem being on bad teams as long as people are trying. Its when people come in and screw up the server is where I have issues.

People don't like that, it is fine, but you guys have yet to tell me what I do to get banned. SWEARING??? Is that it???? You have never told me to stop swearing.

You asked me to call admins when things were going bad, I did exactly what you have asked. An admin came in and watched a guy sit in a full server just asking for trades, that admin did NOTHING!!!!!!!!! While the continued assault on my position of this being a team game continues to go without and explination, just BAN BOOM. Thats the easy thing to do. Members of your own server have backed me on several occasions. This admin did not talk to me AT ALL. How is that fair? My logs speak for themselves. I talk... A LOT! But I also play hard, I don't do anything that screws up the game. What is wrong with that???

So you guys care more about me swearing at snipers and asking for people to work as a team.... than you do Spectators not playing, and having games where teams win in 1 min because of 5 snipers on a crappy team. HUH ??? That does not make sense.

So please. Save me the "disruptive in server" stuff. Games where bad players play bad classes is way more disruptive than any words I can put on the screen.

Thanks for letting me vent.

BOOM

[Chez-Box 3,240]

[HeadSh0tBrent 2,156]

Play competitive.

[Ruby 9,039]

Acceptable:

Hey guys, we don't really need 4 snipers.

4 snipers is too much, either get points or play a different class

Fuck this, we have too many snipers.

How the fuck did that engy set up in our base?

Unacceptable:

hey faggots quit being shitheads and help your fucking team

fuck you asshole play or dont play

Why the hell would you even say:

(read from the bottom up)

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE i don't care if u were or not

Mom you do know I'm kidding, right

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE we dont' need "more spies"

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE cuz you are being disruptive

Mom well gee

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE fuckin idiots

Mom why the ban

Mom wow

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE voteban mom

Mom WE NEED MORE SPIES

Mom We don't

Mom You're right

Dead Ringer (F2P) we dont need 3 spies..

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE all at bottom of scoreboard?

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE wtf do we have 3 spies?

Soviet Heavy! lol im not a kid

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE we don't need 2 snipers 2 spies

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE not playin with kids who refuse to switch from sniper

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE get off this team sniper

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE votekick hipster

So, to reiterate:

1. You were not banned for swearing. As long as you aren't being an asshole towards other people or spamming, swearing is allowed, as, after all, this is a game which is rated M.

2. Being banned for words actually makes sense. I come to Lotus servers to play a video game and enjoy my free time, and of course to kill all sons of bitches. I do not come to Lotus servers to get yelled at by a random guy I've never met for playing a particular class, game style, to be insulted or CALLED A FUCKING IDIOT FOR MAKING A JOKE.

3. You were banned for being a toxic player. Nobody likes to lose and we always do our best, which sometimes includes coordinating the team. However your lack of sportsmanship amazes me. When you lose, it's always your team's fault, it's never you. When you lose, you think your opponents are idiots and not genuinely better players. That's the wrong attitude. Take it to another non-Valve server and see how long you last. Losing is a part of the game. Yelling at your team will not help at all.

4. Pubs aren't professional. One of my best online friends is a div 2 scout. When he plays a pub, he likes to be a caber demo or a pan scout. Another two of my online friends are UGC Platinum soldier and medic. When they aren't crit-rocketing everyone, they play for fun and go battle medic or similar things which make no sense in comp. While they all prefer to win, it's called a public game because they are open to everyone, from sandvich dispenser heavies to ESEA Invite demos. And it's not on you to police who you want on the Lotus server. If you want to do that, TF2 servers are very cheap these days.

[Climhazzard 654]

He is still going on about it? We can get a site ban any time now...

[BloodRedWidow 3,508]

Ok Boom, I get that your a good player - you keep saying it, and hell! you're probably better than me. But there are always other circumstances beyond the game. Perhaps the spies were inexperienced with the class, or unfamiliar with the map. You don't know these things! Calling them idiots and yelling to them - well, you come across as an asshole. HeadShotBrent is right - take up competitive and see how far you get
Remember that you were a new player once

[-MW- 5]

Team Fortress is that...

A TEAM GAME.

What I say during a game is just that... WORDS.

Being banned for WORDS, just doesn't make sense.

I play the game right, I play it well, I play it hard. Nobody can debate that. What does it matter what I say to people who are playing sniper/spy/scout on a bad team? I ask people to switch from certain classes when the team is not doing well. There is nothing wrong with that. They don't have to listen. They have every right to continue to snipe, spy, or play scout. I have the right to bitch about it.

I have never had problems with good players, or good games. I don't have a problem being on bad teams as long as people are trying. Its when people come in and screw up the server is where I have issues.

People don't like that, it is fine, but you guys have yet to tell me what I do to get banned. SWEARING??? Is that it???? You have never told me to stop swearing.

You asked me to call admins when things were going bad, I did exactly what you have asked. An admin came in and watched a guy sit in a full server just asking for trades, that admin did NOTHING!!!!!!!!! While the continued assault on my position of this being a team game continues to go without and explination, just BAN BOOM. Thats the easy thing to do. Members of your own server have backed me on several occasions. This admin did not talk to me AT ALL. How is that fair? My logs speak for themselves. I talk... A LOT! But I also play hard, I don't do anything that screws up the game. What is wrong with that???

So you guys care more about me swearing at snipers and asking for people to work as a team.... than you do Spectators not playing, and having games where teams win in 1 min because of 5 snipers on a crappy team. HUH ??? That does not make sense.

So please. Save me the "disruptive in server" stuff. Games where bad players play bad classes is way more disruptive than any words I can put on the screen.

Thanks for letting me vent.

BOOM

Acceptable:

Unacceptable:

Why the hell would you even say:

(read from the bottom up)

So, to reiterate:

1. You were not banned for swearing. As long as you aren't being an asshole towards other people or spamming, swearing is allowed, as, after all, this is a game which is rated M.

2. Being banned for words actually makes sense. I come to Lotus servers to play a video game and enjoy my free time, and of course to kill all sons of bitches. I do not come to Lotus servers to get yelled at by a random guy I've never met for playing a particular class, game style, to be insulted or CALLED A FUCKING IDIOT FOR MAKING A JOKE.

3. You were banned for being a toxic player. Nobody likes to lose and we always do our best, which sometimes includes coordinating the team. However your lack of sportsmanship amazes me. When you lose, it's always your team's fault, it's never you. When you lose, you think your opponents are idiots and not genuinely better players. That's the wrong attitude. Take it to another non-Valve server and see how long you last. Losing is a part of the game. Yelling at your team will not help at all.

4. Pubs aren't professional. One of my best online friends is a div 2 scout. When he plays a pub, he likes to be a caber demo or a pan scout. Another two of my online friends are UGC Platinum soldier and medic. When they aren't crit-rocketing everyone, they play for fun and go battle medic or similar things which make no sense in comp. While they all prefer to win, it's called a public game because they are open to everyone, from sandvich dispenser heavies to ESEA Invite demos. And it's not on you to police who you want on the Lotus server. If you want to do that, TF2 servers are very cheap these days.

Darwin said it best. There's not much more to add, except this:

I have warned you, countless times, not to be so rude to other players. You have had far more than a fair chance.

You even tried to threaten and bully me on one of my alt accounts. (Still waiting on that demo of me, btw.)

If there's anything you don't understand about your ban feel free to re-read Darwins post or simply follow this simple rule:

"Don't be rude to other players."

[BOOM=DYNAMITE 2]

1. You were not banned for swearing. As long as you aren't being an asshole towards other people or spamming, swearing is allowed, as, after all, this is a game which is rated M.

(This is a team game, if people aren't playing like a team, who is the asshole?)

2. Being banned for words actually makes sense. I come to Lotus servers to play a video game and enjoy my free time, and of course to kill all sons of bitches. I do not come to Lotus servers to get yelled at by a random guy I've never met for playing a particular class, game style, to be insulted or CALLED A FUCKING IDIOT FOR MAKING A JOKE.

(Once again "FUCKING IDIOT" is just words. If you don't like it, ignore it. Proving my point you are banning me for words.)

3. You were banned for being a toxic player. Nobody likes to lose and we always do our best, which sometimes includes coordinating the team. However your lack of sportsmanship amazes me. When you lose, it's always your team's fault, it's never you. When you lose, you think your opponents are idiots and not genuinely better players. That's the wrong attitude. Take it to another non-Valve server and see how long you last. Losing is a part of the game. Yelling at your team will not help at all.

("always do our best" NO!!! THAT IS THE POINT!!! These guys aren't trying. That is why I get mad. It has nothing to do with winning or losing. I don't care if I lose. In fact i've said WORST TEAM EVER a million times. What I hate is when people don't try. If they "always do our best" like you said, I wouldn't be here. So you are proving my point)

4. Pubs aren't professional. One of my best online friends is a div 2 scout. When he plays a pub, he likes to be a caber demo or a pan scout. Another two of my online friends are UGC Platinum soldier and medic. When they aren't crit-rocketing everyone, they play for fun and go battle medic or similar things which make no sense in comp. While they all prefer to win, it's called a public game because they are open to everyone, from sandvich dispenser heavies to ESEA Invite demos. And it's not on you to police who you want on the Lotus server. If you want to do that, TF2 servers are very cheap these days.

( Just because its a pub doesn't mean you should be able to be a screw-up. When you play pick up basketball and a guy is firing up half courters... you wouldn't want to play with him, would you? I don't have the right to police the lotus server, correct But I do have the right to display my displeasure in the way MY TEAM is playing. Is there a problem with that? )

HeadShotBrent is right - take up competitive and see how far you get - I have! With THE LOTUS CLAN TEAM. They play the right way! We lose, i have no issues. They have fun playing with me, and I have a blast playing with them. Your point?

I have warned you, countless times, not to be so rude to other players. You have had far more than a fair chance.

You even tried to threaten and bully me on one of my alt accounts I've never been "warned" by you or your multiple accounts. In fact, I remember you taunting me, and saying a bunch of crap. So taunting players as a lotus member is acceptable? You want people to be all nice, yet you are a jackass. Interesting theory.

this one was my favorite

BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE we don't need 2 snipers 2 spies
BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE not playin with kids who refuse to switch from sniper
BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE get off this team sniper
BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE votekick hipster

This was on a team of 10, and we were getting smoked. People were mocking and switching to sniper. I tried to get away from Hipsters team, and he joined mine just to be a jerk. I was nice. I asked people to stop playing sniper and spy. I switched teams.... he followed me. Does anything happen to him??? NOPE. You guys seem to side with guys like this. He can play the way he wants!!!! That seems way more "disruptive" than me calling him a fuckin idiot.

Hope that explains a bit.

Still haven't brought up the fact I did exactly what you guys asked and called an admin. The admin did not talk to me and let a player continue to spec while requesting trades. Once again, you seem to think me wanting guys to work together is more disruptive than a spec on a full server asking for trades!

Just telling my side.

[DEATH STRIKE 573]

It's only a game...calm yourself

[Ruby 9,039]

(This is a team game, if people aren't playing like a team, who is the asshole?)

If you want a team, there are plenty of places to find one.

Once again "FUCKING IDIOT" is just words. If you don't like it, ignore it. Proving my point you are banning me for words.

Then you can also say "well 'eat shit n*gger' is just words, why would anyone beat me up for using it. also 'all jews must die' is also just words, why would I get arrested for saying those words in Germany?".

"always do our best" NO!!! THAT IS THE POINT!!! These guys aren't trying. That is why I get mad. It has nothing to do with winning or losing. I don't care if I lose. In fact i've said WORST TEAM EVER a million times. What I hate is when people don't try. If they "always do our best" like you said, I wouldn't be here. So you are proving my point)

Some people's TF2 reach is going w+m1 or spamoman. At those times, if you really want to help, it's best to be helpful in chat or direct new people towards helpful learning resources, or just leave it to them if you don't have the will/time. If there's some disruption going on (such as 5-6 people being afk or idling or not killing) you can always deal with the situation by calling an admin...

( Just because its a pub doesn't mean you should be able to be a screw-up. When you play pick up basketball and a guy is firing up half courters... you wouldn't want to play with him, would you? I don't have the right to police the lotus server, correct But I do have the right to display my displeasure in the way MY TEAM is playing. Is there a problem with that? )

Obviously you got banned and warned for that, not once but twice. First time I was on your side because I thought you'd change. Second time - this time - we're peacefully telling you where you were wrong so that you can calm down and continue being a good server regular when the ban ends. Third time, we won't have that much patience.

TF2 is vastly different from basketball, but if you want to compare a game of TF2 with a pickup game of basketball then you should not compare pub tf2, but pick up tf2 games. Again, yell at these guys for not being a team all you want, although that might earn you negative karma or whatever TF2Lobby has these days.

I have! With THE LOTUS CLAN TEAM. They play the right way! We lose, i have no issues. They have fun playing with me, and I have a blast playing with them. Your point?

Good!

I've never been "warned" by you or your multiple accounts. In fact, I remember you taunting me, and saying a bunch of crap. So taunting players as a lotus member is acceptable? You want people to be all nice, yet you are a jackass. Interesting theory.

I wouldn't really call people with the banhammer jackasses, but your call.

This was on a team of 10, and we were getting smoked. People were mocking and switching to sniper. I tried to get away from Hipsters team, and he joined mine just to be a jerk. I was nice. I asked people to stop playing sniper and spy. I switched teams.... he followed me. Does anything happen to him??? NOPE. You guys seem to side with guys like this. He can play the way he wants!!!! That seems way more "disruptive" than me calling him a fuckin idiot.

Hope that explains a bit.

Chat logs can be taken out of context at times, yes, but still no reason to flame people like that. Lotus has over 90 servers at your disposal, and TF2 itself has about 30 times that much. If you are displeased with people on one server, you are free to go on another one.

Still haven't brought up the fact I did exactly what you guys asked and called an admin. The admin did not talk to me and let a player continue to spec while requesting trades. Once again, you seem to think me wanting guys to work together is more disruptive than a spec on a full server asking for trades!

Just telling my side.

Can't verify/talk about other admins. I got a call from someone a while ago saying there's a party in 2fort sewers with guys being assholes, I handed out 30 minute bans after they flamed me as well and all was good, but I don't think that was you.

Edit: Also, please don't flame at us. You won't get anywhere with that, and we'll just extend your ban, much at Chez-Box's displeasure. As long as you stay calm and keep the conversation civil we can work something out.

[Hipster Cookie Monster 3]

Hey, Remember me? yeah im the guy you tried to vote kick just because I was playing sniper and you didn't like it, you have been vote kicked and vote banned many times for being an asshole to people in a pub, these servers aren't for competitive plays, we don't care if we are not playing how you want us to, if i want to be a sniper im going to be a sniper, ive gotten more kills as a sniper than you have a demo and that seems to be the only class you play, I was also the top player as sniper, and maybe other people wanted to try sniper people, deal with it, if you don't like us not playing exactly how you want us to, lotus has over 90 servers, go play on another server, because of what you have done you have built up bad reputation on the server.

[Kitten 1,813]

Still haven't brought up the fact I did exactly what you guys asked and called an admin. The admin did not talk to me and let a player continue to spec while requesting trades. Once again, you seem to think me wanting guys to work together is more disruptive than a spec on a full server asking for trades!

I was the admin who responded. I asked what the problem was, listened to you and the others who responded, and left to read the chat logs. I noticed a player in spec, who didn't ask for trades while I was there, and said he was about to join back. I don't know if he did, I left to start researching the problem on your server.

I suggest you take this ban as a little time out to realize that this isn't about how you play; your harassing other players, beyond making you the antithesis of a good team player, isn't going to be tolerated. Change your attitude, or your change your community.

[-MW- 5]

I have warned you, countless times, not to be so rude to other players. You have had far more than a fair chance.

You even tried to threaten and bully me on one of my alt accounts I've never been "warned" by you or your multiple accounts. In fact, I remember you taunting me, and saying a bunch of crap. So taunting players as a lotus member is acceptable? You want people to be all nice, yet you are a jackass. Interesting theory.

I wasn't greifing. I told you not to be rude, then laughed when you tried to bully and intimidate me with a demo. If that's how you're treating other players, I am genuinely concerned.

The taunting was done by pressing the "f" key. If you can't deal with playing the game, don't play.

I want everyone to enjoy the game. This is true.

I am sorry to hear that you feel I am a "jackass." I am sure you insulting me further on the forums for explaining to you the problem will impress everyone and lessen your ban.

[Chez-Box 3,240]

these servers aren't for competitive plays, we don't care if we are not playing how you want us to, if i want to be a sniper im going to be a sniper,

This is going to be my last post in this thread, but I hope more people can look at comments like these, and realize this attitude is the problem, and Boom is trying to be a solution. A pub or not, a team should be making an effort to win the game, if not, then there is no point in playing. Whether you feel you are playing well individually, it doesn't matter if you aren't helping your team succeed. It's god. damn. FUCKING. ridiculous. If you are going to play a team game, be prepared to play as a team with people. Saying it's a pub is no excuse for anybody to play like an idiot to the detriment of the rest of their team. I have many good friends I met playing on Lotus servers, before I was ever a member or an admin. We used to have fairly high level competition on our server of choice nightly, and usually had a solid group of a dozen to 20 regulars in a given night, we all knew each other. This kind of idiocy is what made the majority move to other pubs, where they could still play the game with a team playing with a degree of competency, where a team can have a common goal, and strive to play together to meet it. If you don't care about the objective, or winning as a team, go fucking play MGE or whatever, go snipe people in a trade server. I'm not saying everybody needs to play at a competitive skill level, what I'm saying is people should be prepared to play the team game as a team, even if that means you can't always play your personal favorite class. I get it, BOOM is banned a month, whatever, a staff member made that call, far be it from me to question it. Just saying some people need to get a clue.

edit: bolded profanity, since we do that now

[-MW- 5]

This is going to be my last post in this thread, but I hope more people can look at comments like these, and realize this attitude is the problem, and Boom is trying to be a solution. A pub or not, a team should be making an effort to win the game, if not, then there is no point in playing. Whether you feel you are playing well individually, it doesn't matter if you aren't helping your team succeed. It's god. damn. FUCKING. ridiculous. If you are going to play a team game, be prepared to play as a team with people. Saying it's a pub is no excuse for anybody to play like an idiot to the detriment of the rest of their team. I have many good friends I met playing on Lotus servers, before I was ever a member or an admin. We used to have fairly high level competition on our server of choice nightly, and usually had a solid group of a dozen to 20 regulars in a given night, we all knew each other. This kind of idiocy is what made the majority move to other pubs, where they could still play the game with a team playing with a degree of competency, where a team can have a common goal, and strive to play together to meet it. If you don't care about the objective, or winning as a team, go fucking play MGE or whatever, go snipe people in a trade server. I'm not saying everybody needs to play at a competitive skill level, what I'm saying is people should be prepared to play the team game as a team, even if that means you can't always play your personal favorite class. I get it, BOOM is banned a month, whatever, a staff member made that call, far be it from me to question it. Just saying some people need to get a clue.

edit: bolded profanity, since we do that now

Nobody is allowed to tell anyone else how to play their game. It's a video game.

Is TF2 a little more competitive? Yes. Is there any reason to kick or ban players based on their skill level? No.

There is a difference between constructive criticism and outright insults. BOOM hasn't been able to find his way to constructive criticism yet. Instead he chooses to be rude and offensive to as many players as possible, then take credit for any victories his team makes. Once BOOM realizes he can help players instead of hinder an entire team based on his own perceptions of how a video game should be played I'm sure he will be welcome back with open arms.

BOOM can take this ban as a time-out. Once he's ready to come play nicely with others there won't be any problems.

I believe the problem has been explained and solved multiple times making this thread no longer relevant.

If a Staff Member would be so kind as to lock the thread... Thanks!

[fever 9,884]

I can see both sides of the argument and would rather people were team players. I don't think there is any reason to speak to people in the way BOOM has though. I appreciate he is frustrated, but I joined Lotus for the friendly, tolerant, helpful attitude of the people in the community...not because someone said "You should join Lotus you f***ing c***"

[Climhazzard 654]

some people need to get a clue.

You are right...some people do...

[- Mike - 2,728]

I understand where you are coming from, me being one of the most competitive personalities here tf2 wise. I truly do, but you have to remember that this is just a pub. That means you'll be playing with people who have literally just installed the game or that people just want to dick around. You have to spend those frustrations and just go fragging like crazy and play behind your team so they can be the meatshield, or just go play some lobbies for more controlled pubs. Or you can take a step up and pug. People pug all day, you just have to find those people.

[BloodRedWidow 3,508]

Ok, all I'm getting here is a subtle difference in perspective. Boom thinks that everyone should act as a unit, whereas I think that pubs should be a relaxed affair.
Boom is right - TF2 is a TEAM game. No denying that.
But there are many facets to a team, different team styles etc.. If my team has taught me anything, is that people with in a team are individual, with individual play styles. And it's HOW you apply that play style that counts, that's what helps decide who loses and who wins. For example, I was playing medic in sawmill once, turned around and the entire team was pyros. I swear this is the truth. Some of those pryos were exceptionally good at airblasting, and our team won because of that!

And we all have different levels of skill. Seeing as you (Boom), have playing in the Lotus team, which I think is platinum level? I don't find it surprising that you get frustrated in pubs, you're too used to playing with a kickass team! But pubs are for unskilled players, or peeps who just want to chill out. Try lobbies - they seem to be more to your tastes

Perhaps it would be beneficial of Lotus to set up some more professionally inclined servers? We could, but I imagine that would introduce skill based cliques and divide Lotus in the long run. Something I'm sure none of us want.
But I'm babbling. You get my point.

Edited September 23, 2013 by BloodRedWidow

[Gotcha 6,307]

and boom goes the thread lock.